Friday, December 23, 2005

An Urgent Appeal to H.H. Pope Shenouda III نداء عاجل لقداسة البابا شنودة

On December 6th, we brought to Your Holiness' attention, an appeal written in Arabic concerning what happened at the Coptic Christian Centre of the Church of the Virgin Mary and St. Athanasius in Mississauga, Canada when the church allowed Mr. Omar Alghabra, the Liberal candidate for Mississauga-Erindale to deliver his speech for winning the nomination. Those who gathered in the Coptic Christian Center were chanting "Allah Is Greatest, Allah Is Greatest" to be followed by Mr. Omar's speech who started by saying "This is a victory for Islam! Islam won! Islam Won! Islamic power is extending into Canadian politics"

Omar Alghabra

Your Holiness, this is the same church that prevents Coptic activists from speaking out about the injustices against our people in Egypt saying the church is no place for politics. Now that the story is making it to the press and is getting the public attention, we are appealing to Your Holiness to investigate what happened inside the church during the speech of Mr. Omar and why was he allowed to deliver the speech in the first place!

29 Comments:

At 11:43 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

على رأى عادل إمام : دى أشكال ينتخبوها
ده شكله منقوع فى مية التخلف
اما الكنديين دول عالم هبلة صحيح

 
At 12:20 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

The solution is simple. I hope all the copts will vote Conservative in this election. If I was in Mississauga, I would have definitly voted conservative. A similar appeal should be sent to Paul Martin. He has to be more prefessional than that.

 
At 12:23 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

After looking at the candidates' profile, it seems to me the Conservative has the best CV. I would vote for the man before the party.

 
At 2:51 PM , Anonymous kennethk said...

Hi there,

Just wanted to send an update your way, because it turns out that Mr. Omar Alghabra was falsely accused. Evidence now suggests that Mr. Alghabra did not make the statements that were intitially attributed to him.

However, it is clear that someone at his nomination rally did make those statements, and current suspiscion falls on a civic councillor for Markham, Ontario.

Please see the following articles:

Well, that explains the blog traffic recently...

Mr. Alghabra did not make the ''Victory for Islam'' comment -- an apology

Khalid Usman: the one who actually made the comments?

What did Omar Alghabra really say -- Part II

So what, exactly, did Omar Alghabra really say?

Cause for Worry (OR PERHAPS NOT)

Cheers,
- Ken

 
At 5:32 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

So one would think the sysop will retract the article, but that wouldn't be consistent with the seething hate simmering so deep inside...

 
At 6:10 PM , Anonymous Victor said...

I was there, the church has it on video....the Pope should remove the priest

 
At 6:15 PM , Anonymous ADEL said...

AS AN EGYPTIAN I KNOW FOR SURE THAT SUCH THINGS CAN HAPPEN, MUSLIMS REGARD THEMSELVES AS BEING AT WAR WITH THE INFIDEL WEST. EVEN IF THEY DENIED IT, THAT WILL BE ALLOWED IN ISLAM AS ISLAM ALLOWS THE MUSLIMS TO LIE IN 3 CASES AS THEIR PROPHET SAYS: ONE OF THEM IS WHEN THEY CAN LIE AT WAR BECAUSE WAR IS A TRICK AS MUHAMMAD SAID. SO THIS IS DEDICATED TO THE ANONYMOUS MUSLIM COMMENTATOR WHO IS IN DENIAL OF EVERYTHING. STOP CRYING AND ADMIT THAT YOU GUYS ARE TROUBLEMAKERS WHEREVER YOU LAND. LOOK AT THE MAP, SEARCH FOR TROUBLE AREAS..THERE YOU WILL FIND THOSE CLAIMING TO DEFEND A VAMPIRE NAMED ALLAH

 
At 6:17 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

على رأى عادل إمام: اجلقوله

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b9/PopeShenouty6.jpg

ولا هاتوله استك منه فيه زى الجدع ده

http://www.sikhmatrimonials.com/sikhnet/singles.nsf/FullPhotoDisplay/BSA

 
At 8:34 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is a sad story and reflects the narrow minded Coptic Christians. Mr. Alghabra election is a good news to ALL Egyptians. We should encourage other Egyptians to participate in the affairs of their communities, and we should learn from them as well. Mr. Omar, if you were in my district and if I believe that you are a better candidate than the others, I would have been the first to vote for you. For Mr. Omar to give his victory speech in a Coptic Church hall is a great honor to the eternal friendship between Christians and Muslims of Egypt. We should invite more people.
As for sending a letter to POPE to investigate this issue, I would say that is childish behavior from whoever sent this letter. If I were the Pope, I would have been embarrassed by the inadequacy of my people. Walk up, and take charge of your life. You opened the Church hall, and someone shouted ‘Allah Akbar;’I would say well for him. It is called autopilot reaction. Nothing in it is offending to the Church or to the faith.
The Coptic Church that I know has always tough to LOVE my enemy. Yes, this is Christianity. This our faith, we love success of our Muslims even if they make our life difficult. We love them even if some Muslims wish us dead. We love not because we hope that those who hate us will accept us sometime in the future. We love them not that we are afraid of them. We love them, because our God LOVES them and everyone else with ever lasting love.

There should be no need for any further investigation and wasting of time and resources. We should congratulate Mr. Omar and we should always keep our love and heart open to everyone (Muslim or Christian, Jews or gentile, slave or free) because in this way we honor our heavenly Father.
eemc2203@yahoo.com

 
At 8:39 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

About the writer of the comment above, this proves the mentality of islamists and is enough to make sure such a candidate does not succeed. I call everyone to vote conservative in this riding. Regardless of your political leaning, this is a strategic vote. We don't need these mentalities in our parlement.
To speak in the writer's language, we do not need garbage in the parlemant. Garbage better go home.

 
At 8:44 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

After posting my message, I saw another one by an angry Muslim. I believe that you are wrong in assuming that all Christians are against you or your faith. You have the right to believe in any thing you want, but one thing you need to know about true Christianity, we love you because our God loves you too.
In fact a true Christian cannot hate, because God is love. Love brings life into the world, hate brings darkness.
We are called to be children of light, which is God.
eemc2203@yahoo.com

 
At 10:14 PM , Anonymous Ayman said...

To eemc
I have to disagree with you, this is a sad day, but not because of what you said, it's sad that we pay millions of dollars to build cathedrals in the west while our people in Egypt are suffering from poverty, and when some try to speak out against what's happening to them the clergy stops them, but at the same time allow the Muslim hate mongers to promote their ideology inside church. If they chanted "victory to Islam" and the priest did nothing to stop this non sense inside the church he has not been faithful to the altar. The Pope stopped a priest in Giza last month for two years because he criticized Mubarak in the Katiba Tibia magazine, yet leaves these priests promote Islam withing the church buildings. if you are a true Copt you would not say what you said. enough of being passive...enough of the culture of darvishs that got us no where

 
At 10:59 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Aymen,
Thank you for disagreeing with me. I am not passive; in fact, I would tell you that the Pope is wrong in what he did to the priest in Giza. In one hand the Pope wants to improve the voice of the Coptic community, yet by this act, he is undermining the same hope for freedom for all Egyptians.
As for the case in Canada, it did NOT happen in a Church but in a Church hall. If I opened my hall to you, then I have to live with MY decision.

As for our attitude toward the suffering and the poverty of the Egyptians’ Copts, I have to remind you that MOST Egyptians are poor. Therefore, we should work hard to help ALL Egyptians. Unless our struggle for freedom is universal (meaning that it apply to Muslims as well), the prospect of any better future for Egyptians is very limited. We should be the champaign for the rights of the Muslims fanatic and the Muslim brotherhood who are mistreated by the government of Egypt. And with the same mouth we should also protest the mistreatment of the Christians at the hands of the Muslim fanatics. We should speak for all the poor and misfortunate. We should raise the banner of humanity for ALL Egyptians. We should reject the government when it mistreat my enemies (as they defined themselves) as much as when it mistreat my friends.

To say that we have a particular problem, I would agree and disagree with you. I disagree with you, because there is no such balance in this world. Many grow up thinking that the world should be fair to everyone, but that is never true in all societies, or places at any time in history. Ask any Muslim, and he will tell you examples of the injustices being done to Muslims. Ask the same question to any group and you will hear stories about their suffering. These are deep issues of nonlinear Characters (technical), therefore, do not have easy solution.

Christ our God lived among Jewish people who were occupied by foreign Army (the Romans), YET, He did not pay much attention to the external occupation, but to the internal one which is sin. Therefore, I am following the example of Jesus, I am worried about Copts who are so loud in their objections to Muslim control of Egypt, yet blind about their own passion and sins.
Our struggle is not against Muslims or Islam, but against sins and spiritual principalities. So we should focus our energy in proclaiming Christ as the only hope and salvation to mankind. Any issues beside this are trivial, even if it were honorable in the eyes of those who regarded with such energy.
eemc2203@yahoo.com

 
At 12:33 AM , Anonymous cs said...

"we love success of our Muslims even if they make our life difficult"

eemc, until now I had respect for your words. But this time, you've gone to far. YOU ARE A SELF-HATING SUICIDAL COPT. That is, if you ARE really a Copt at all.

So you love when Muslims are successful at making our lives "difficult" as you say? Well, you must have taken great pleasure in seeing your fellow Christians massacred in El Kosheh! What a thrill that must have been for you. And hearing about Christian girls in Indonesia getting their heads chopped of and put on display in the village church, well, I can only guess how happy that must have made you.

You love hearing about these things because you are a coward. Each new "success" as you call them, gives a fresh vehicle to fantasize about being the victim and gaining martyrdom. Well let me tell you, you armchair martyr: THEIR BLOOD WILL NOT HELP YOU!!!

You have a sickness. I will pray that you get the help you so desparately need.

 
At 5:37 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Canadian Copts are a disgrace to the Coptic nation. They are as incredibly foolish and ignorant as their retarded government which is kissing up to Muslims and attacking the United States. The have drank from the poisonous chalice of Marxist-Pro-Islamic-Anti-American-Anti-Christian propaganda.

The fact that the writer is seeking refuge in the Pope shows the incredible lack of moral fortitude in the Church congregation. The congregation is paying that Priest “of Baal” to live in Canada and bring up his kids. Since he is such a sap for Muslims, let him go back to Egypt and walk everyday while Muslims kids through filth at him, fanatics try to run him over, his wife and kids remaining under the threat of kidnap and rape, etc. Then again, nothing bad ever happens to this sort of a priest because he does not deserve to suffer for the faith. He will keep on living a life of ease, committing his heresies and outrages, spitting in the face of very suffering Copt through his flamboyant liaison with Muslims.

 
At 5:38 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Egyptian term 3arass is too good for that so called priest..

 
At 11:28 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear CS

If you look again at your post, you will understand the ‘spirit’ which is behind the writing! I feel that there are anger and despair in your words which are not from God.
I believe that you misunderstood my words. I chose these words ‘we love success of our Muslims even if they make our life difficult’, specifically to expose the spirit of hate that is permeating the entire world. As I said before, irrespective of what the Muslim fanatics do to us, we must keep the spirit of love and forgiveness in our heart. Otherwise, in addition to losing worldly possessions, we might also lose our eternal salvation.
The war that Islam declares on us is not directly related to you and me, but it is on Christ our God. The hate to the name of Christ and to salivation is not coming from some simple radical Muslims, but from much higher dominion who wants you and me to hate Muslims so we become under his dominion.
This war is spiritual and never is physical. So don’t be naive thinking that if someone uses slightly more powerful weapons, then Islam will disappear tomorrow and its followers will be liberated. The issue is much deeper than this.

You have the right to call me any name you like, But I am servant of Christ. I know that my redeemer already overcomes this world, so I rest in His peace knowing that nothing can happen to me or my people who trust in Him can shake our faith in the living God. A true child of God does not have spirit of fear.


Romans 8:15-17 states:
For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, Abba, Father. The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, then heirs – heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.

 
At 11:30 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

"If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you. Remember the word that I said to you, 'A servant is not greater than his master.' If they persecuted me, they will persecute you; if they kept my word, they will keep yours also." (John 15:18-20 RSV)
eemc2203@yahoo.com

 
At 11:38 AM , Anonymous Anthony said...

eemc
You are completely off here. Try to get out of the nutshell and believe in something called "Your Rights". There is a big difference between accepting the cross and seeking the cross. Your way of thinking resembles that of someone who enjoys suffering when there is a chance to end it. This is a sick attitude that is contrary to my Christian faith

 
At 11:46 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anthony,
Go after your rights, but don't lose your soul in the process.
eemc2203@yahoo.com

 
At 12:02 PM , Anonymous Anthony said...

To eemc
Don't worry about me. a true Christian stands up for the truth.

What happened to "My house shall be called a house of prayer, but you have made it a ‘den of thieves")
Mt 21:13
Those priests you are defending should have driven out all those who bought and sold in the temple of God, and overturned their tables have turned instead of turning the church into a den of thieves

 
At 12:22 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am sorry, we started with what happen in the local Church and went to the situation of the whole Church. Irrespective to happen in the local church, it is nothing but miss calculation on the part of the priest. But I still believe that the good well toward Egyptians should continue. Many will disagree with me and that is Ok.
Th following are my comments regarding the Coptic Christians in general.

His is a summary of my ‘cold and secular’ position


If you are facing a problem, then find a solution. And at least start by changing yourself. Most of the solution is within your control. Support the people, help the poor, and protect the week by all means.
I don’t mind exposing the brutality of the fanatics, but in addition, we need to change our self first, otherwise, we should not expect much change.
African Americans’ struggle in the USA should be a good model for us. We should write about the civil rights movement in books to all Children in Egypt. This way people will grow and understand the evil side of discrimination.

It is a long road, so stay logical.

 
At 2:24 PM , Anonymous cs said...

Revelation 6:9-10

When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the alter the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne; the cried out with a loud voice, "O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before thou wilt judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell upon the earth?"

Eemc, you might have expected the Martyrs in heaven to send their best wishes to their murderers, or to ask the Lord to give them his blessings. However, as you can clearly see, this is not the case. In my opinion, one who calls himself a servant of Christ, who is in no danger himself, and who does nothing to oppose those who would slay his fellow servants, but instead eagerly awaits and celebrates when true Christians are persecuted and slain, is morally equivalent to those whom the Saints in Heaven have asked the Lord to punish.

What have your suffering brethren in Egypt done for you to spare them your mercy?

 
At 9:08 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear CS
You are truly very hurt. I am not sure that I am helping you. You did not mention the last part of that verse:

11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.
Dear brother, nothing happens to you or to our fellow Copts without the will of God. God will see that they are rewarded accordingly.

It is hard to forgive those who hurt us, but we must trust in Christ first:
Luke 6:27-31 "But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you." I have meet Muslim fanatics from Egypt coming to Christ. Wait and pray brother for their salvation. Muslim fanatics are too victims of the devil, they deserve our love and prayers. As for you personally, please join in a

I wish you peace, love and joy in Christ Birthday.
This site might help you understand

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-persecutedchurch.html

 
At 11:29 PM , Anonymous cs said...

eemc,

I admit that I was angry and inflamed when I responded to your "we love Muslim success" post. But believe me, I mean nothing personal when I say that you (and your kind) are traitors to your own people. I am convinced that you are a Christian and that you don't think of yourself as a traitor. But you are.

Yes, whatever happens to us is God's will. Does this mean we let our children run across a busy street? If they are hit by speeding cars it is God's will, after all. Am I right?

You are a misguided traitor. I hope you will learn that defending your fellow Christians and BEING a good Christian are not mutually exclusive. It is our duty -- mine and yours -- to care and act on behalf those who are persecuted, down-trodden, and endangered. You obviously did not understand the verse from Revelation. Martyrdom is NOT something we should hope for. Not for ourselves and certainly not for others! It is only God's role to permit it, just as it is only God's role to permit our natural deaths.

Be very careful, eemc, for if you succeed in discouraging Copts from protecting one another, you may wind up with blood on your hands. Again, this is not a personal attack; it is merely fact.

Merry Christmas.

 
At 12:33 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear CS.
Merry Christmas to you as well. One thing I need to explain here, I am not saying that it is Ok that we allow thugs to attack our Churches. I have no illusion about their intension toward Christianity not only in Egypt, but also in Turkey, Iraq and any place with a large Islamic populations. There are many thugs surrounding our people, but the reason there are plenty of them is due to the lack of freedom and poor understanding of the values of humanity in Muslim countries. Remember that our people live in a primitive culture and the values of all people are considered to be cheap.

I noticed that you were angry, and I don’t blame you, but don’t allow your anger to unleash wars on everyone around you. I experienced hurt as you did, but I struggled for three years so that God will not allow hate of any kinds to enter my heart.

Our church is not of this world. When our father rejected protectionism from foreign nations and countries, they were much wiser than you and me. They knew that God is our ONLY protection. This was their belief since the dark age of Islam and it should also be ours till God intervenes in His own way. Remember that there is NO country, or an Army or a power that can provide a protection to a victim Copt other than the protection of Christ our God.

I encourage you and others to speak up for the victims of the Coptic Christians; yet, don’t also forget the other poor Egyptians, the Muslims. They too are victims. When we speak for all sufferers, we testify to a greater God who loves all humanity.

I pray that one day you will understand the blessings of being a Christian.
eemc2203@yahoo.com

 
At 10:12 AM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

To Victor and company.

Your ignorance is abundant in your foolish commentary. We wonder why the Egyptian Coptic plight has been slow to grow but the answer is evident in such posts. If you had an ounce of intelligence you would be able to discern that these priests would never in their right mind support such Islamic movement. If anything the church is for the advancement of the Coptic cause by encouraging the involvement of the congregation in the political activities in the this federal election.

The events of that night are obviously misconstrued. This was a nomination party for the Liberal Party of Canada held on their request. This party was a run off election between a Muslim candidate and Charles DeSousa. The Muslim man won and things were said which were inappropriate. But to say that priest endorsed and encouraged it is ignorant and without basis. Furthermore, in order to be able to vote in this party election, one must be a registered Card holder. This was not a n open election.

You may be puzzled at why the church would hold such an assembly at all.
Well, in keeping with the US Copts Association’s spirit and the command by Christ to ‘give to Caesar’s what is Caesar’s’ (generally interpreted as a Christian’s duty to recognize and participate in government), The priests wished to see more political involvement by the 1900 families at the church. In fact, they encouraged the congregation last week following the morning Khiak liturgy to become involved in the governmental process. It was mentioned in that same announcement that *THE CHURCH DOES NOT ENDORSE ANY ONE CANDIDATE OR PARTY BUT THAT WE HAVE A DUTY TO ACT IN ACCORDANCE WITH OUR BELIEFS AND OPINIONS.*

I am certain that His Holiness, who has blessed the largest church in the diaspora many times, has the facts and is reasonable enough to discern that this church would not be supporting such political activities.

Thank God for rational and intelligent people that exist in this world. Something this blog needs more of.

In the words of Johann Wolfgang von Goethe "Nothing is more terrible than to see ignorance in action." This discussion is entrenched in just that, an abundance of ignorance. Seek the truth before making foolish comments and ignorant conclusions. Defamation of character is something that is illegal in the western world. You are no longer living behind the lawless walls of Egypt where one can levee ungrounded charges and claim ignorance.

 
At 7:38 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

love ludacris lyric runaway

 
At 3:32 PM , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Enjoyed a lot! how to make paintball bunkers Free computer slot machines on my computer Cosmetics in ilion ny new york eagle sport roller skier concerta+dosage+for+adult Buy cheap what is neurontin bontril buy http://www.gpscar.info/Renault-game.html Convertible dining Uk car satellite navigation hempstead circuit breakers Voyeur breast enlargement pics concerta aggitation ati video card problem 54mg concerta er tablet Blood pressure equipment Abbey national travel ins

 

Post a Comment

Subscribe to Post Comments [Atom]

<< Home